Right now you're basing your eyes on Pat Pulse, and I'm here with Artist Manager, Entertainment Executive. He works with some of the greatest that you've ever seen, and he does his job extremely well. Ladies and gentlemen, Ian Schwarzman. Thank you buddy. This is my brother. How are you? I'm great man, can't complain. Have you took the time out to come here today? For you I take the time. Thank you man, I appreciate it. I'm very familiar with your work, but for the people out there who don't know. Yep. What exactly is it that an Artist Manager does? Your manager is more of the CEO of the company, and you're the owner, right? Like the manager is really the person running the company of the artist. And so we end up being the eyes and ears of the artists. We end up speaking as if we are the artists in a lot of scenarios, and that's built over trust, long periods of doing good business with your clients. So hopefully that's not too vague, and I'm not rambling on, but it's really such a dimensional position to play with entertainment. Let me ask you this. You know, you do business management for DJ Premier. Yep. Joe, you've done business management for my wife, myself. Yes. I mean, I mean, we like family, you know what I'm saying? Absolutely. Needless to say, I can keep going. Famous comedians, a lot of people, a lot of individuals out there, you're behind the scenes, and people just don't know that. Sure. There's a hungry artist out there right now, and their dream is to work with someone like you. Sure. What is it that you look for in an artist? What does an artist have to do to get on Ian's radar? I notice the effort more so than the end result. The effort's what screams at me, like, look at all the stuff they're building without help. Imagine what this could look like with someone like myself, who could come in and add resources, relationships, the ability to get into certain rooms that you never have access to. The same things that you do consistently with Tunecore and the artist is introducing them to a new way that maybe if you would have known all the way back in the day, you would have taken it too, but no one really pushed you in that direction. Right. All right. I want to speak to the managers out there that's watching this as well. So you've got some artists out here, and they may have a couple million or they may have millions and millions of followers on social media. Oh, yeah. Right. And you have individuals out there who inspire you to be managers. Sure. They want to become managers. And they look at these artists, hey, I would like to manage this artist. I would like to manage that artist. When they get that opportunity, yeah. The artist places their contact on their profile. Yeah. And now they're like, all right, I'm your manager, and they sit back and they put their feet up. This is one of the things I think that you do well. If there's a tour going on, reaching out to that tour, hey, can I get this artist on that tour? Absolutely. Creating, if there's a movie happening, if there's something happening, I feel like the job of a manager is to add on. Not just stand in front of the spot and wait for sales to come and stop the customer at the door and say, no, do it here. You're absolutely right. Or going out there and creating those opportunities. So I wanted you to speak to the managers out there. What advice would you give them about creating opportunities for their clients? That's a good point, first of all. Managers, most of you are lazy. Your jobs are replaceable. And eventually you will be replaced if you don't get up and begin to be proactive. This is a eat what you kill business. I mean, and that doesn't go across the board. There should be fair business done. Depending on what you bring to the table, there's bigger conversations to be had with your clients. But I see a lot of desk jockeys and very few proactive managers. Your job isn't to just collect checks, but to set up strategic partnerships, strategic opportunities, consistent and continuously being proactive. This is not a check grab. It's a game of strategy, right? The way we get to the top is by a million little moves, not one move, nothing one time ever changes anything. And I think managers need to take it upon themselves to earn what they think they're worth instead of coming in having high demands and then putting an email up and taking a passive role in artists career. I see too much of that now. It's really disappointing. But for me, I like seeing it because it separates me from the crowd. Right. I like it because I know my style of management is more hands-on. It's more curative. It's more collaborative and it leaves a very special small place for people like me who take it that seriously and are trying to leave a legacy behind. Right. And I just want to add this. You know, you spoke about that and I like your answer on that. And I want to add, it's about enhancing. So, you know, managers out there, make sure you pay attention to what's being said. We're just passing on valuable information. That's what we're doing. The passive role is replaceable. The proactive, I'm going to make myself irreplaceable. To me is the only path. Those are the kind of people I want to work with are people who take their craft or job seriously enough that they're trying to make their spot irreplaceable. Everyone is kind of, you could take them out and put someone else in. But there are a handful of people, there's those few people across a lifetime, that do something to make themselves immovable. And I have a lot of respect for those people and those are the people that I model my career off of. So that when I'm done, I can be like, I gave it everything. That's what's important to me. Sometimes it might take you a while to find that right person with that right chemistry for you. All the steps that, all the steps to manage your relationship. Take your time, but when you do find that right person, make sure y'all go together. There's certain spots along the way with entertainment and music and this business where it really challenges your willpower. Like for real. I've seen it for him. I was young and hungry, but when I came into his life, he was already salty. Like meeting, he had been through it. He'd been to the very top and then also had issues with the label and then also had a temporary time away from his wife with Remy leaving and I saw him in really fucked up spots. People don't really understand why certain artists and managers shit works out. It's really because you get it. You get the, like we come from different places, but we come from the same place. You know what I mean? Like our head, what we're after is very similar. And so two different worlds colliding. He'll be like, this is what I'm trying to do. And then I have this different perspective that probably sounds like fucking Chinese to him. But eventually we learn each other's language and great stuff happens. And with him, with DJ Premier, with Michael Rappaport, with Remy, with Joe Budden, with Royce, with Brady, all these people I work with, that's the common thread. Like if artists are looking like, don't, it's not, don't try to get to me. It's, I'm going to find you if you, you appeal to me. And vice versa, like artists shouldn't look for big managers. They should look for the right collaborators. And then the reverse, managers shouldn't look for the biggest artists. They should look for the artists they're most motivated by. Like that's the things, the protocols that are missing. Everyone's really after a big check. My business isn't built off of that. That's, that's why I'm proud of what I do. And I'm grateful for him. He's the first real artist I've managed. So I have different type of respect and history with him. But this shit is not just job. It's, it's, it's really like toes the line when people go, oh, I don't take it personal. I do. I take it all very, very personal because I don't put in eight hours a day. I'm 24 hours a fucking day because everyone's relying on me. That's right. And that's what these people out here that want to be managers don't get is unless you're willing to put everything out there to make this happen, it's not even worth starting. That's another thing. And get ready for a lot of, you know, letdowns. We don't hide it. We don't hide the struggle. We don't have what we've been through because we want y'all to know in case you're going through a struggle, we don't want you to think you got to give up. Look at us now. Oh, we're not struggling no more. But I'll tell you this. We went through the struggle and we made that transition. We're proud to be able to say that we fought through that. Like we were working together. Like he said, things weren't good. You know, I've been to the mountaintop, been on the major label, had the humongous deal and my eyes, the eyes that you look at now had to sit there and witness my world crashing down. God bless your dad. I remember K Slade called me on the phone. He said, hey, Pap, are you sitting down? I said, yeah. He said, your deal, my job, just folded. And I'm talking about, I was on top of the world. That was my dream to even reach that point. But I never think of that moment when I got that call. And simultaneously, you know, my wife went through her situation. She became incarcerated. So I lost my deal. I lost my wife. And I said, forget about music. I need to focus on my family. And I just focused on my wife so much that I stopped working. And things fell apart for me. I fell upon hard times. So when I finally got her more situated, and I said, I need to get back to work, that's when I met this gentleman right here. Cheese steaks and fillet. And we got on the road. We got back to work. And we grind. We worked extremely, extremely hard. You're giving y'all the game. You're giving it to y'all. Y'all just got to take it. Don't give up, man. Always believe in yourself. Be persistent and consistent. Bet on yourself. Bet on yourself. There you go. Okay, who getting your way, man? What are some things a manager isn't expected to do? Good question. I got one thing for all aspiring managers out there, or current managers. Don't be a yes, man. That's the one thing you can't do. It may be intimidating. There may be tough situations you're in, where money's on the line, or there's pressure from the artist. Pressure from the artist's team around you. Do not ever be a yes, man. It's the biggest mistake you can make. You will land 20 steps back from where you started. Hold your ground. Make sure that you take this shit seriously. Have an opinion. And it may be the opinion that your artist needs. I love that answer. And I spoke to Pring about this before with you, and I told him that. One of the things I like about him, is his motherfucker will challenge me. You have to. Because you're wrong. You know what I'm saying? You're wrong. Not on the top. Because you're wrong a lot of the time. A lot of the time is crazy. I'm wrong too, but that's the beauty of it. Is that no one's ever right 24 hours a day. No, that's real shit. Real shit. And man and man, you always respect that. A yes, man is the worst thing in the world. Even snaps. Snaps challenges me. We love snaps. Get snaps. Okay. What should an artist look for in a manager? Someone who takes their role seriously. Someone who's not scared to stop looking at the clock and just work till the mission is done. And someone who's going to be there when times are down because I hate to break it to you, but the entertainment business is like a roller coaster. So what goes up must come down and be prepared for it. Should an artist be on the hunt for the manager, or should they just let the manager find them? An artist shouldn't be on the hunt for a manager. I think an artist should be on the hunt for greatness in whatever their craft is. Once they start fine-tuning what they're great at, I believe the right people will start to notice what you're doing. I don't like titles that much, so I feel like calling it a manager is boxing yourself in. You're looking for collaborators. I'm very much a fan of the term collaborator as opposed to anything else because I feel like that's what artists and managers alike both need. There's some people out there who have what I call a sense of entitlement. They feel like just because they know a certain artist that they should be in that position of that artist's career. And when I say that position, I mean as the manager, as the DJ. It's nepotism. They don't want to work for it, but they feel like, hey, I'm your friend. No, I'm who it is. I'm your that. So why you can't let me get that position? Right. But at the same time, they don't have to know how. They don't have to drive. They don't have the ambition. You don't have the focus to help that artist go to the next level. So as an artist, you want to have a career in this, right? You want to be successful. You know, you have these individuals with a sense of entitlement. What do you say out there to those type of people? I think those type of people should reevaluate why they're trying to be involved with set artists. I think it's usually mal intent and people looking for an easy ride. I don't want to judge with a general blanket because there are exceptions to the rule, which I'm aware of. You're aware of helping put capable, able and willing bodies and people in position who deserve it, who have the ability, the knowledge, the credential, or not the credentials, but the ability and knowledge to actually add value. I'm all for it. On the other hand, I'm not supportive of putting a career in somebody's hand who looks at it like a hobby. And I think Steve, from down the block, is more than likely looking at it like something exciting and fun for the moment. Which is deep. We can be detrimental to your career. Which can be very detrimental. Listen, I'm going to say this. Leave Steve alone. You heard the word that he used, collaborator. Collaborate. Manage yourself. When you manage yourself. Hell yeah. A great manager will come into your life and collaborate, like Ian said, with you. But you got to take the initiative to do it yourself. And when I say manage yourself, watch your surroundings. Like he just said, go ahead and play around with Steve from down the block. And you're going to be with Steve at down the block. You want to tour the world. You want to take care of your family and be successful. Take your career seriously. Don't put it into the wrong people's hands. Leave by example. And I guarantee you, great managers, producers, DJs, all will come into your life. He's absolutely right. That's what happens. Amen. That's right. Listen, I want to say thanks to my brother Ian for coming and chopping the door. I love you, man. I love you, my brother. I'm here for you. Definitely, man. Likewise. Listen, it's not all, every day of your life, you get to see a dope, experienced, focused manager in front of you, giving you the game. It's up to y'all to listen. Y'all come up to me all the time and say, yo, Pap, I'm looking for a manager. Yo, Pap, I'm trying to get on this tour. Yo, Pap, I'm trying to get on the radio. I'm giving it to you now. The man is in front of you. He's giving you the jewels. What more can I say, man?